Update or Transfer from FamilyTree Maker to TNG

[Marla]

I need help on how to update additional information in TNG, since I made some corrections, editions and added new information in my Family Tree Maker. It is a big time consuming when working manually in TNG.  I read the instructions in WiKi but I was not able to follow them. How can I update by transferring the information from Family Tree Maker to TNG automatically?  I would appreciate it if someone can help me with this, especially with the step-by-step instructions. I don’t want to make a big mess in TNG without your kind of help.

[Chris Lloyd]

I can't think of any automated way that you would be able to update FTM and have the same changes done in TNG. My understanding is that you would have to export a Gedcom from FTM and import the Gedcon to TNG.

[alanw]

I do not make any edits or additions in TNG, having always found it easier to work in other places and then import the changes into TNG via Gedcom. I used Family Tree Maker (FTM) that was synced to my ancestry.com account.  I use both FTM and ancestry.com for data entry, update and modifications.  In order to upload the Gedcom that was generated from FTM in the past, a person needed to use one of the "mods" from TNG users that corrected some defects in the Gedcom so that it would work properly with TNG. The process was not for the "faint of heart" - there are a number of steps involved.

Having said the above, note that everything may be working quite differently now that FTM has a new owner and a new version-  FTM 2017. Recently, there was a post in the forum about someone who was working to see how a Gedcom from FTM 2017 would work when imported into TNG. I am unsure of the current status and compatibility. 

For now, my TNG tree is begging to be updated, but I am waiting to hear how best to import data that is generated from FTM 2017.

 

 

[georgicus]

I have been playing with exporting GEDCOM from FTM 2017, and then importing that into TNG.  Actually, I have been obsessed with getting this working because there are six of us collaborating on a tree, and TNG is a really nice way to display things.  I have two major observations:

WRT workflows --  there are only two workflows that seem to work reasonably well.

1. ONLY edit in FTM, export the GEDCOM.  Then blow everything away in TNG and write import the GEDCOM to a clean database.

2. In FTM, export the part of tree you updated, then import "append all records" into TNG.

For workflow 2, it helps if the new GEDCOM and TNG have minimal overlap. That's because you have to meticulously (and somewhat tediously) merge individuals which is, in my experience, easy to screw up.  For me, this really means working on small parts of my tree at a time, and try to get everything perfect before merging into TNG.  I make small edits in TNG itself.

When I started, I tried importing the whole FTM tree (via GEDCOM) into TNG using the "replace all current data" and the "replace matching records only" options, and I ended up with a mess.  I am not sure why, but it might be managing the family links -- One of the things I noticed afterward were nonsense family records, ie. a record with no parents and one child, or a record with one parent and no children.

 

[georgicus]

The other observation is that some of the gotchas for FTM described on http://tng.lythgoes.net/wiki/index.php?title=Desktop_gotchas are no longer current.  These were all caused by the file that FTM outputs as GEDCOM -- just enough deviations from the standard to cause problems.  The combination of TNG 11.1 and FTM 2017 works a lot better than the gotchas would lead you to believe. 

I have an awk script that I use to make some of the transformations that are documented for the GEDCOM converter mod (I do not use the converter itself). This is what I have discovered -- just skip to the last paragraph if you are not nerdy enough to open GEDCOM in your text editor.

1. The part about taking descriptions from BIRT, DEAT, RESI, and other tags and making them into proper NOTE records -- this is  no longer needed.  In fact, it is actually counterproductive because TNG will take the contents of the NOTE record (plus any continuation records) and display it as a separate note, instead on inline.  (And I definitely like inline better)

2. FTM *does* pass media filenames into the GEDCOM.  (I think this is what the gotcha page means by "media links".) TNG will take this file name BUT, you do have to upload the media files manually to TNG.  I am not sure whether uploading the media files should happen before importing the GEDCOM.

3. TNG does not pick up FTM's decsription (in FTM, the "Description:" field under the media tag). Rewriting the _TEXT record to be a NOTE accomplishes this.

4. TNG does not seem to support media attached to a source *citation* as opposed to a source record.  This is the little picture FTM shows if you are in the "Person" window, with "facts" selected (the default), in the list of sources cited for that fact, if any.   Both FTM and standard GEDCOM support this, and FTM does put this appropriately in its GEDCOM.  You pick one of two hacks in the converter -- either attach every media file included in the citation also to the individual, or attach each of those to the underlying source.  IMHO, only the the first approach makes sense.

All said, only fixes 3 & 4 are necessary now (with FTM 2017 and TNG 11.1), and these are pretty minor features.  All in all, I am very happy with the fact that TNG "just worked" with my FTM 2017-generated GEDCOMs, and it is only that I am obsessing about details that I notice these little issues.  Please, if anyone has played with the GEDCOM details, let me know!

[theKiwi]

19 hours ago, georgicus said:

I have been playing with exporting GEDCOM from FTM 2017, and then importing that into TNG.  Actually, I have been obsessed with getting this working because there are six of us collaborating on a tree, and TNG is a really nice way to display things.  I have two major observations:

WRT workflows --  there are only two workflows that seem to work reasonably well.

1. ONLY edit in FTM, export the GEDCOM.  Then blow everything away in TNG and write import the GEDCOM to a clean database.

2. In FTM, export the part of tree you updated, then import "append all records" into TNG.

For workflow 2, it helps if the new GEDCOM and TNG have minimal overlap. That's because you have to meticulously (and somewhat tediously) merge individuals which is, in my experience, easy to screw up.  For me, this really means working on small parts of my tree at a time, and try to get everything perfect before merging into TNG.  I make small edits in TNG itself.

When I started, I tried importing the whole FTM tree (via GEDCOM) into TNG using the "replace all current data" and the "replace matching records only" options, and I ended up with a mess.  I am not sure why, but it might be managing the family links -- One of the things I noticed afterward were nonsense family records, ie. a record with no parents and one child, or a record with one parent and no children.

 

The most reliable way is to use Option 1 every time - it's what I've done for about 15 years or however long I've been using TNG.

The crucial thing you have to have control of is that Family Tree Maker doesn't change the ID numbers of anyone - this is applicable if you have media items linked  to people or families.

Option 2 requires too much thinking to deal with the issues you noted.

Roger

[georgicus]

Not many people have accused me of too much thinking!

I agree that option 1 is much, much easier.  I happen to use option 2, because we have things organized in multiple trees.  Also, we make small changes right in TNG, so it is effectively the master copy now.  (As scary as that seems.)

[theKiwi]

9 hours ago, georgicus said:

Not many people have accused me of too much thinking!

I agree that option 1 is much, much easier.  I happen to use option 2, because we have things organized in multiple trees.  Also, we make small changes right in TNG, so it is effectively the master copy now.  (As scary as that seems.)

What do you mean by "trees"?

Do you mean whole separate Family Tree Maker databases that are loaded into TNG as separate trees?

If so, Option 1 still works as you can only replace a single tree at a time with the "Replace all Current data" option - the other trees all stay the same as they were until they too are replaced.

Roger

[Marla]

1 hour ago, theKiwi said:

What do you mean by "trees"?

Do you mean whole separate Family Tree Maker databases that are loaded into TNG as separate trees?

If so, Option 1 still works as you can only replace a single tree at a time with the "Replace all Current data" option - the other trees all stay the same as they were until they too are replaced.

Roger

I am not following what is meant by "Replace all Current data" and "Apprend all records".   What is the difference?  When I import new data from FTM 2017  and transfer the data to TNG, TNG does not match what is in FTM.  It gets duplicated or triplicated and I have to go back to TNG to modify things to match what is in FTM. 

[stores]

In short... replace all current data replaces what you currently have in TNG with what you are importing... Append all records adds what you are importing to what you currently have...

[Marla]

On 9/24/2017 at 10:26 AM, stores said:

In short... replace all current data replaces what you currently have in TNG with what you are importing... Append all records adds what you are importing to what you currently have...

For all of you, thank you for your great answers.  Before importing, in Go into Settings>Configuration> Import Setting,  Should "Default Replace Option" setting be checked on "All current data"?  And then Go into "Import/Export>>GEDCOM Import" Setting,   should I check both on "Replace and Append" while importing? 

 

[stores]

Hello Marla

If FTM is your primary genealogy program and you make all your changes in that program then when you import a gedcom into TNG (secondary genealogy program) then yes, check replace all current data... 

One thing you need to keep in mind is that if you regularly delete or merge people in FTM then the RIN or ID numbers will change and that might effect any images or documents and what not you have linked to people in TNG.

I use PAF as my primary and TNG as my secondary and to ensure this does not happen I always check for deleted records prior to exporting to a gedcom... If I do have a deleted record then I fill in that record prior to exporting.

Another option you might want to do as well, just for peace of mind until you are comfortable, is to back up the tables under Utilities in TNG before you import a gedcom, then if something does go wrong, you can restore the tables and be back where you were before the import.

[theKiwi]

6 hours ago, Marla said:

For all of you, thank you for your great answers.  Before importing, in Go into Settings>Configuration> Import Setting,  Should "Default Replace Option" setting be checked on "All current data"?  And then Go into "Import/Export>>GEDCOM Import" Setting,   should I check both on "Replace and Append" while importing? 

 

You can make the setting for "Default Replace Option" to "All Current Data".

what this means is that when you go to Import, the All Current Data will automatically be checked for you and you can leave it as it is. This setting (in Options) prevents you from forgetting to change if it was defaulted to something else.

If you are importing a GEDCOM file of your whole database, then you never want to use the other options (like Append all Records).

Roger

[Robin Richmond]

Sorry, folks, that it took me so long to see this thread.

I'm responsible for the Gedcom Converter mod (which is mostly, but not exclusively about FTM Gedcoms), and wrote most of the FTM content in the Wiki's Desktop Gotchas article (at  http://tng.lythgoes.net/wiki/index.php?title=Desktop_gotchas ).  I just finished making significant changes to the Desktop Gotcha's article, and am working madly to finish a new version of the Gedcom Converter mod - even newer than the Beta version listed in the Gedcom Converter wiki article.) 

I'll now get new posting in this thread, so I'll be able to follow-up on questions more effectively.

FWIW, I have also published several other Gedcom Import mods that might be useful to you:

1. Gedcom Import Mediatype, which helps keep track of new media items associated with Gedcom imports. It is an attempt to solve the vexing problem of finding Censuses, Documents, and Histories that have been mis-identified as Photos because of their .jpg file extensions. 
2. Gedcom Import Monitor, which I believe gives a much better picture of the Gedcom import process than the native TNG dashboard does.
3. Gedcom Import Purge, which cleans up old Media Links, while allowing you to add (and retain) media links within the TNG software
4. Gedcom Import Second Name, which imports name components (e.g. suffix, prefix, nickname, etc.)  that are associated with a secondary name event.  (The native code imports secondary NAME events as 'custom' events and stores the entire name as the event value,  but ignores subordinate name components. This mod simply incorporates any subordinate name components into that single name value.

The Admin Media Predefined Search mod is also intended to address problems with FTM Gedcom imports. It defines several keyword searches that identify media items that are in the wrong TNG Collection (that is, that have the wrong Mediatype value), and helps you assign those media items to the correct Collection.

Finally, I have a private mod that changes the default state of some of the checkboxes in the Gedcom Import kickoff form at Admin >> Import/Export.  It also makes a number of similar changes to Admin forms.  I'd be happy to share that mod, and if it does some things that you don't want it to do, I'll help you extract what you do want from it.  Who knows, I may even find time to parameterize it so that you can tell it exactly what you want it to change. 

- Robin